The Untold Podcast
UNTOLD Podcast is where business, family, and life collide—raw, unfiltered, and brutally honest. No fluff, no fake success stories—just real conversations about the highs, the struggles, and everything in between.
The Untold Podcast
Women in Business Pt.2 | Crying in the Car & Holding It All Together
Running a business is one thing. Holding your shit together while doing school runs, chasing invoices, and being “fine” all the time? That’s another level.
In Part 2, Kelly and Danielle talk:
- Crying in secret vs. showing vulnerability
- What it's like when YOU are the brand
- The unspoken pressure of being a mum and a boss
- How their partners carry the load (and don’t always get the credit)
It’s raw. It’s relatable. And it might just change how you look at women in your life.
🎙️ Part 3 drops tomorrow.
I thought it'd be really good for other female listeners to hear what it's really like running a business.
Speaker 2:I wanted this building from the January. I didn't get the keys till the end of September.
Speaker 1:That's a long time of anxiety.
Speaker 3:It was awful. You are not my customer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm not going to take that A board in, and that's fine you are not my customer.
Speaker 3:you don't get me To genuinely learn from your mistakes. Yeah, own it and admit to it and build on it.
Speaker 1:Today's episode is sponsored by Closer, the app that helps you discover exclusive local deals right here in Sussex. Whether you're after a pint, a haircut or a last-minute gift, closer shows you where to go and what you can save, all from the comfort of your phone. It's free to download, easy to use and packed with offers from the best spots around. Download the Closer app today from the App Store. That's C-L-O-S-R. Save money, support local with Closer. Hello everyone, and welcome back to another episode of the Untold Podcast. So we touched on like mental and sanity. What? Like mental health? What do you do when you have, when things are tough and you still have to be mums, you still have to do the school run, work going bad, what? What do you do? How do you deal with that? What?
Speaker 3:any tips or tricks. My sandwich in the car? That's where I have my lunch when I'm on a delivery. Private crying that's a lie. I don't cry, I'm a bit emotionally dead, isn't?
Speaker 2:it. No see, I cry Because if I don't cry, it will come out as anger for me. So I have to cry, I do, I have to, I have to have some sort of something has to come out of my face. Yeah, because it's either going to be shouting yeah and angry or crying like I don't have much of an in-between. I'm very emotional as a person, actually, and I try and put on this bravado that I'm like really tough, I'm not, I'm soft as shit and yeah my emotions, like you know.
Speaker 2:I had to struggle not to cry in front of a client the other day. Really, yeah, I really struggled not to. I was really holding it back. I could feel the, the prickles behind my eyes and my designer, carrie, was looking at me like and it was all because, like, he thought that I was supposed to be going out to visit site, um, but it turns out I did twice but he was away for the whole month, yeah, that we were fitting out. So so for me I was like I did. Obviously I didn't let it come across that way, but yeah, I struggle to keep it in because, like we were saying earlier, like it feels so personal when things go bad yeah, yeah, it feels so personal, like when I worked for other people, I cared.
Speaker 2:I cared about the client and what they thought, but also like I didn't care either, but it wasn't a personal dig.
Speaker 3:if someone doesn't like something you're doing, I would just be like I could direct them off to a manager somewhere.
Speaker 2:I didn't. I'd just sort of be like okay.
Speaker 1:And now it is you, now it is me, and now your staff is you? Yeah?
Speaker 2:Your Now.
Speaker 1:it is you Now it is me, and now your staff is you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, your brand is you Exactly.
Speaker 1:The shop. Is you the window is being cleaned, is you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is such a shift to have to take, and I think it's a lot of responsibility. The mental- load that women do have. There is a big mental load that women have, I think and I'm sure men have that in their own way as well. Men have that in their own way as well but I think women are mums, wives, daughters, yeah, business owners in our case. Um customer satisfaction, people, feedback gatherers, um, you know, actual florists like actually designing things. It's like you're everything in one and I do it's it's hard.
Speaker 3:I think there's also an emotional load for women at home because it's natural that women take on emotional pressure from, say, their husbands come home and they've had a rough time at work. I think women through the generations and this is something that is just wired into women can take on that emotional pressure from their husbands as well and feel it. You can feel it when they walk through the door and they've had a rough day.
Speaker 1:We did an episode a little while ago and we sat down and we were like right, who is the rock in your family, in your relationship, in everything? And the episode sort of started off as us, as men, feeling like we're the rock. We have the financial goals.
Speaker 3:Yeah, this is a really interesting point and within 15 minutes of that episode, we were like we're not the Rock at all. I don't think sometimes men realise that women just naturally feel the men's energy.
Speaker 2:Natural empaths.
Speaker 3:And if you know they've had a terrible day, you've kind of take on that, and sometimes I don't think the guys know that you've taken on a little bit of that Because there's nothing we can do about it. I can't go out and do your job for you or make it any easier or, you know, get that deal that you're trying to trying to win but somehow we like absorb some of that stress and that pressure.
Speaker 1:You know not to give your shit. Yeah, you know not to give your shit.
Speaker 3:Now's not the time to tell him how shit my day was or how good it is, because you don't want him to feel like, Because you don't want him to feel even shitter.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, oh, fuck off my day what you're rubbing it in now.
Speaker 3:You're rubbing it in now.
Speaker 1:And yeah, we did an episode and it started off like thinking yeah, we're the rock.
Speaker 3:We're not the rock at all.
Speaker 1:And you look back.
Speaker 3:I think you are, I think just like we're ingrained to be that emotional support Men make women. I don't know about you, but Paul, like there's a strength around him, not because he's physically I mean he is strong, but not because he's feeling like you just feel safe that I've got a man at home and that he's out there working. I'm working as well, but there's just something about having that man there and he's got your support, yeah, he has.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think something I picked up on earlier was when you were telling the story of how paul basically forced you into doing what you do kicked you in.
Speaker 1:There's the lace, there's the case.
Speaker 2:Make it work and the fact that sean gave up all of his inheritance into you know, I think, when you find someone that really believes in you. I don't think either one of you are a rock. I think you are.
Speaker 3:It's just that well, actually, you know, it's not even equal. I heard something really interesting the other day is relationships are not 50 50 some days they're 10, 90, yeah, yeah. Some days they're 70, 30, yeah you've just got to be able to sense when he's 30, I'll be the 70.
Speaker 1:I'll pick up some of that Sometimes.
Speaker 3:I'm only 10% today and he'll pick up the 90. And you've just got to be able to read each other and know.
Speaker 1:And make it work, and make it work yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but men naturally want to fix things as well, yeah, they do sometimes women don't want you to fix it, just want you to agree, just want you to let us cry, or just want you to give us a hug. Just agree, cook us dinner or just something. Just a little natural act of love, just perk anyone up? It's just that kind of thing with the tea towel, just anything, just anything just yeah exactly, just anything, just yeah, just so that I know you're there.
Speaker 3:I don't need you to fix it. I don't need you to fix it, I don't need you to make it right. And I'm one of these people as well. When I'm really down and I'm struggling with something, you could give me the best advice in the world, and I'll have a reason why it's not good advice, and that's one of my red flags. I know that about me, and what I actually need is for someone to go yeahlly, that's really shit. That must make you feel really shit. See, this is what.
Speaker 2:I'm really glad that we found each other sounds a bit you know each other. I'm glad that we came across each other, though, because I don't know any other women like they there is just there is women like that out there.
Speaker 3:It's just that no one puts it forward yeah everyone's all over social media with all the best bits. It's like a trailer. Everyone's life is a trailer I want to see all the edits I want to see the crushing and burning?
Speaker 2:yeah, I do. But like this is like we'll, we could text each other like really randomly, sometimes like completely randomly, sometimes about flowers, sometimes not. And, um, you know, I've noticed that a lot of the time, if we've got a problem or we'll just like lightly mention it to each other, most of the time the reply from evious will be like that's really shit, but it will be all right. Yeah, like we don't try and fix things, don't have the solution for you because, you're women in business.
Speaker 1:You talk to each other about business. Yeah yeah, we have yeah, do you both feel like a burden talking to your friends If things are going shit in?
Speaker 3:your business. There aren't business owners.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there aren't business owners that are working jobs. They could have been your best friends for life. Because this is quite interesting, because they say that men need to talk more about everything emotionally. Now, girls, obviously with your friends, you'll talk about oh, he's an arsehole, or this happened, or this happened, that. But do with your friends you'll talk about oh, he's an arsehole, or this happened, or this happened that. But do you talk to your friends about your business.
Speaker 3:I'll offload a little bit to my friends, like I've had a rough day and they've said, oh, what's up? And I'll say, but I don't expect them to understand. Like I will offload just to so they know why I'm acting the way I'm acting, because I'm a window you can see right through me. Like there is no hiding if I've had a bad day or a good day. Like there is, just there's, not there's. If I've had a bad day, everyone knows about it.
Speaker 3:So they'll ask oh, what's up, what's happened? And I'll be like, oh, I just had this arsehole customer, oh, what, what happened? And I'll explain. And I don't expect them to understand because they're not in my, in my field or they're not you know. But just letting it off my chest helps, but it's not the same as talking to another person in business, because quite often they can relate and you can feel that yeah, yeah, that for sure.
Speaker 2:I don't really have many friends oh.
Speaker 1:I do.
Speaker 2:I have.
Speaker 3:I have lots of people that I talk to uh, yeah, talking to, I actually only have a handful of friends, but really like my actual closest friends that I would ever say.
Speaker 2:I think things are really really, really fucking bad at the moment. It's probably one person and she doesn't own a business, so she also does the oh, that's really shit. Yeah, but she but in a sense of she doesn't get it, she doesn't know how shit it is, whereas if I say to you that's really shit, I know you've you know, and I felt it too, so it is difficult.
Speaker 2:I also have one of my my best, one of my best friends owns her own business as well, which is totally like, completely different to what I do different overheads, different, um, you know valuation different stretches, you know, and, um, I find it really hard talking to her about business because you know her turnover and stuff it is not, it's got, there's nothing like mine, because mine's high value sales, hers isn't. So it's really difficult because she'll be like well, why are you doing it like that?
Speaker 2:and I'm like because that's how it's done, because that's how we have to do it because of x, y, z, you know, and so I actually find it quite difficult talking to my friend that's in business, because, yeah, you naturally kind of think it's the same but it's not have different people.
Speaker 3:You must the same have different people you tend to talk about, like I've got certain friends that if paul's pissing me off. I'll tell her, because she'll be like, yeah, he's a wanker. Tell you what you want to hear um, so you kind of have different people that you tell different things to, because you actually it is, because you know they can relate. So, um, like, if the kids are pissing me off, I wouldn't go to one of my friends that doesn't have children about that. I'd tell a friend that has children that they're pissing me off.
Speaker 3:I've got one child who has extra needs um and he's um, he's is that.
Speaker 3:Paul yeah, as well as him and um, so lots of like extra needs in school and stuff and he is, he's really hands-on, it's really hard work and I've really only let off steam to him, not even to a friend. I've got a couple of people that I know I've got like neurodiverse children and they're the ones that if I happen to see them or be in the same, I'll almost want to tell them what I'm going through at the moment and I just let let them know it's the people that have gone through the same thing or are going through the same thing that you kind of want to offload those things to. You kind of pick your counsellor for the day.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's difficult, the girls are better at talking than boys.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:I have to squeeze stuff out of Paul. Oh yeah, same with Sean. He might. Oh yeah, same with Sean, like he might be quiet for days and days. And he was doing it the other week. And even my designer, because we work so closely together, like literally I'm looking at her every day and Sean's in the showroom every day. And even she said is Sean okay? And I was like I don't know. He won't say anything if he's not, so I don't really know.
Speaker 2:You just have to let him ride it out. He will eventually. He will tell me eventually, yeah, but yeah, it's difficult. He doesn't talk to enough people.
Speaker 3:I don't. I don't hold on to stuff and Paul does. So Paul can have a problem and it'll be a tiny problem, but it will eat and eat and eat away at him. Even someone swearing at him on the road because they think he's done something wrong and he actually hasn't he'll hold on to that like he can't let it go, whereas I'm a bit like oh, didn't affect my life, I'm over it, so I can. I, if I've had a rough day, I'll let it out, it'll be out there and I can close the book on it. I'm quite good at that. Don't bottle things up. I also don't dwell on things and whereas, um, paul really struggles to let things go and like things will irritate him and he's, he holds on to stuff that's years old and it bothers him. And I'm a bit like Paul.
Speaker 1:You just gotta let that go, yeah you've gotta let that go, yeah you can't change it now, you just gotta let it go one of the big things I've learned over the last few weeks is to I know the business is the business, but try and emotionally unattach yourself from it at times you can't I know it's very difficult, you can't, but you can fly off the rails at a customer, whereas if you give yourself 15 minutes to breathe to compose yourself.
Speaker 1:Your answer is going to be don't not emotionally attach, but don't act on emotion yeah try not to act on emotion, and if that person called you a knob, then let them yeah you're not ever going to be well, they're the things that I can let go.
Speaker 3:Yeah, whereas paul wouldn't be able to do that. I don't think, but I I'm quite good at like just closing the door at the end of the day and being like right, it's done, now let's forget about it. That's an exaggeration. There has been times where things have stayed with me. I've had certain situations at work that I still think about now and it annoys me but generally.
Speaker 1:I'm quite good at switching off being able to not let it ruin, but like learning, that that's a skill you've learned to close the door at the end of the day yeah and sit in your car and breathe before you go home to three screaming kids, dinner, a dog and whatever else you deal with at home. That's something that I've learned and over the last six months is like right, it is what it is, deal with it tomorrow, don't let it ruin you now, and I think that's really important for any business owner.
Speaker 3:That's where I think I'm quite good at going home, getting it out and then being done with it. So we'll tell Paul if we've had something really awful happen or even really good. Yeah, see.
Speaker 2:I think I've. I don't know, though, if that's because I I work with Sean. Yeah, it's different. So you know, we shut the door, but then we go home well, he knows already still, and he already knows that something's gonna have pissed me off that day, or you know, I feel upset by something or annoyed by something, or he knows. And it was even only yesterday, which was Sunday, um, which father's day as well, yeah, um, and we'd just gone for uh lunch at Bill in Lewis, because it's good for kids.
Speaker 3:Oh, we went to Bill's in Horsham, oh, did you? Yeah, I love Bill's.
Speaker 2:And you know we were like got the kids in the car and he went, oh, what's on the agenda for tomorrow? And I was like what?
Speaker 2:I was like why are you thinking about work now? Oh yeah, I know he's like so don't worry, it's like Sunday, we'll deal with that tomorrow. Like I'm not, not talking about it. And he's like okay, he gets like almost offended. That sometimes I don't want, because I I think for me as well as like I am everything in that business. Yeah, I am the designer, the salesperson, the manager, the you know overseer. I'm, I'm everything in it, I'm the face of it, yeah. So any problems, any, or niceness as well, don't get me wrong, but you know it is all on me. So I feel like I need to try and not take work home with me as much as possible, because it's not easy, though yeah, well, sean isn't as involved on that kind of extent, so for him he's like okay, what's going on tomorrow?
Speaker 3:and I'm like shut up I'm terrible for working out of hours I can switch.
Speaker 3:You're always working, I can switch off like thinking about um work. But I'm always if someone we do it me and you. If someone messages me something about work, I know if I don't reply straight away they're not getting a reply. I have to, and even the ones that start with you don't need to reply with to this now and I'm like I do, otherwise you'll never know the answer. Yeah, it's out to the universe. If I don't reply now, you will never know if I can deliver those flowers next friday, because I have to do things right there in the moment.
Speaker 2:I just need to do things instantly see, I've got better at that, because I was like that too. I'm terrible and I just can't do that though this is part of the reason why we decided to bring a designer on as well, though, because offload some of that. I was just killing myself, like I'm just probably not as mentally as resilient as you are, maybe, but like you know, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's partly why I brought on a designer, so I wasn't like for me I was doing a lot of design work at home for hours like till midnight one o'clock Because I had to do so much in the day for business stuff. Yeah, you know the background stuff and the chasing things, Finding receipts and stuff like that.
Speaker 3:Because you're in a shop as well. Also, if someone walks through the door and keeps you busy for three hours talking about what bathtub they should have.
Speaker 3:That's three hours of work that you can do and you have to do it when you get home. And I'm not throwing men under the bus here, but if a woman, I feel like if a woman sat on her phone or her laptop in the evening doing her work, it's a very different image to if a man has sat in the office at home doing his work till 10 o'clock at night.
Speaker 3:I don't think it's still the norm for women to work at home in the evenings, when they should be perhaps looking after the children. I don't know, that's maybe a controversial point of view.
Speaker 3:I do feel like if I go home I get looked at. If I'm sat there working, I do do all my work on my phone. I can't work a laptop. Yeah, I've got Microsoft and I've got everything on my phone so it looks like I'm just scrolling, but I'm actually working. I promise I am actually working. Sometimes I scroll, but I am actually working and I just think do my kids look at me differently when they see me doing that at home, when I should be perhaps washing up or doing or doing something else?
Speaker 1:as to how they look at.
Speaker 3:Paul when he's sat on his laptop working. Isn't it a bit more normal that the bloke can work till 10?
Speaker 2:o'clock? I don't know. So for us, I think my boys are very used to seeing me work. I'm not sure interesting because obviously when this all started, sean didn't join the business until sort of like july august time last year. So I was basically running that whole business on my own for months and he was doing a nine to five that he hated a nine to five that he hated with a passion, um, but was just doing it because you have to keep the wheels turning right, um, but his job was a job that he could shut the door.
Speaker 2:That's it five o'clock, yeah, home time done. Yeah, nothing, no extra work to be done, whereas the boys would.
Speaker 3:That's what they've grown up seeing yeah, constantly bring the laptop home.
Speaker 2:I specifically bought a laptop so I could take it home, so at least I get to see the kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, whether I can, talk to them or anything it's different, but I can see them and I'm there and I'm, I'm there, you know.
Speaker 2:I'm present but not at the same time, so I think for us that's a bit of role reversal, like I think my boys battle each other to who can work.
Speaker 3:Like it's like, have you got to go to work or can I go to work? I've got to pop back to the shop, I've got to get to the office. Like we're, like, have to schedule in our work around our work around each other. And like who's doing the school pickup today? I'd like to stay at work. Can you do the school pickup, shall I?
Speaker 1:it's, it's that's gotta be tough in ourselves around. Does that cause conflict?
Speaker 3:I'll tell you when it caused conflict and it doesn't now.
Speaker 3:So I'm safe to say this when paul was on the tools and he got to a point in his career with the property developing stuff that he you know know, he really started to dislike it and he was really miserable and I mean there was lots of stuff underneath there that caused it with anxieties and he has OCD.
Speaker 3:So he likes a job done properly and working with other tradespeople that weren't doing the job how he liked it was causing him a lot of stress. He got to a point in his career where he really didn't like work but he was working from six in the morning and sometimes getting in at midnight doing these house renos and he would come home and he'd hate it and he was miserable and he's stretched and I was just like I wish I could work from six in the morning till midnight because I love it. I want, I really want to be at work and he earned more money than me so he had more rights over the clock than I did. So if, if he could work, go to work for you know, and do these stupid long shifts and earn three times the amount that I could earn. Naturally we have to let him go because we've got household to run, yeah, but I used to really resent him sometimes for being able, and then moaning about it.
Speaker 3:And I look back now and I'm like, oh, he was just offloading. He was just offloading to me because he was stressed. But I was like, if I could only go to work at six and then not come back till midnight, I would love it.
Speaker 3:I might not, you know, put me in that position and I probably wouldn't love it. That's maybe a bit excessive, but I at the time I used to really struggle with that and I used to want more work hours. It's a lot more equal. So we're in much more flexible positions where he can come home early to do school pickups. He's in a different job role now and we mold it quite well around each other. We kind of have our set days where we know who's doing pick up and drop off and we've got a little bit of a rotor going on where we kind of work quite equally. That's good, but my job now is probably less flexible than his. Like, my shop has to be open at nine, yeah, and it can't close until five.
Speaker 3:You've got two of them so if I can't, yeah, and if I can't cover them I have to be there. Like I can't put a sign in the door saying I've gone home to pick the kids up, like this doesn't work, yeah brb, whereas if pushed, paul can work from home so he could pop out and do the school pick up and then get back to work at home. So we've got a little bit.
Speaker 3:It's not ideal, but when those situations do happen, I think that's one of the perks of working with Sean yeah he does all the school runs oh, if I could delegate all the school runs, I would, though it's not for me.
Speaker 2:I can't hack the school run. I am really cut.
Speaker 1:I love doing the school run a couple of times a month.
Speaker 3:I will honestly I go to school late, and if I'm early I'll sit in my car so that I don't have to do small talk on the playground sorry mums that might be listening it's not you, it's me.
Speaker 1:I would say that 90% of mums feel exactly the same as you, but they still go, and do it.
Speaker 3:It's me. I would say that 90%. I would say that 90% of mums feel exactly the same as you, but they still go and do it.
Speaker 2:They absolutely love it, they live for the school playground chat.
Speaker 3:Oh my god. I've been invited to a new whatsapp group for the playground we went to sports day on Friday and one of the mums walked up to us and said oh, we've added you because we've got another little one going to school in September. And, um, oh, we've added you to the new reception group. I was like please just add Paul. Add Paul. Yeah, leave me out of it. I'm so disorganized I can't do it.
Speaker 2:You tell me something today that it's Roman day next Friday yeah, absolutely no way, I'm remembering that, tell Paul he'll remember the boys are doing business week this week at school and which Maybe I need to go to that. Yeah, well, they're doing business week, so they've got to make as much profit as they can on like they're selling like old key rings, it's super cool, amazing concept, and I love it, apart from the group that he's been put in.
Speaker 2:I said to Isaacac I was like what are you in charge of? He was like key chains and like loom bands I don't know what they are bracelets or something, yeah and I was like, okay cool. I was like have a look on amazon, mate, find some really cheap key rings and, um, like we'll sell them off for like a pound each or something, package them up nicely yeah like sorted.
Speaker 2:He was like, okay, cool, he was dead happy with that. Anyway, of course, I'm in a group chat with the other kids that he's in with, and over the weekend I got these like pictures of handmade key rings and handmade lube bands and I was like I'm really sorry, but I really don't have time to do that but, I, love that you can yeah, and. I think they're amazing. Yeah, so props to you because you are mumming life like so good. But I have just bought plastic tat from. Amazon and he's going to sell them.
Speaker 3:Oh, I'm like that with the cake sale Like all these homemade cakes turning up at school and I'm like no. I literally ran over to the convenience shop this morning, roughed up a banana loaf that was left on the shelf and changed its tin and took it down there. There you go. Absolutely not for me.
Speaker 1:Work smarter, not harder one.
Speaker 3:I think one time there was like a cake sale and I had forgotten. But even if I hadn't forgotten, I wouldn't have been able to bake a cake. I gave the teacher a fiver and I was just like here, I'm so sorry I've forgotten the cake here's fiver. She was like we can't accept cash. I was like, well, we need a cake. I was like what? Just take the cash, put it in the PTA pot, that's what the cakes are being sold. Yeah, right, like she was like I'm sorry. So I was like, oh, so now I'm gonna have to spend five quid on these cakes. I'm gonna take home all these cakes that are full of snot and hairs that someone else has baked, like they just. And I was just like, oh, and I walked away and I was just like, oh god, I feel like that awful mum that's just tried to throw money at an issue.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but, it's a fiver. Yeah, take this, go on. Yeah, just give them a fiver. It was the worst thing.
Speaker 3:It actually wasn't me handing over the fiver. I'd given it to Romeo to give to his teacher and I was like give your teacher the fiver, and she came back out of it after school and gave it back to me she was like it was cakes.
Speaker 2:Do you know what that feels? So like? I feel judgment from the school sometimes.
Speaker 3:Oh, bedtime I do.
Speaker 2:Sometimes I feel the judgment and you know, especially when we were opening the shop and I didn't have any time for my children, I think for about a year, literally.
Speaker 3:I was missing bedtimes.
Speaker 2:I was missing them waking up. I wasn't seeing them like barely at all. Yeah, and you know they scored email about something. I just be like look, I just I'm so busy right now. I just I can't deal with With the space. I just need you to just keep teaching my kids. Okay, they're happy, they're fine. Yeah, like I don't need to know about all this stuff. Can you volunteer for this? Can you do that? And I can't, like I just can't. Yeah, and I think there was a parent's evening where they were like we know you're very busy oh, I get that all the time.
Speaker 2:We know you're very busy and you know, bear in mind, my kids school is literally up the road from the shop.
Speaker 3:We know you're very busy, but um you know if you could get involved in some school activities it really boosts the boys esteem and I thought oh, please like if I had spare time, I'd rather just spend it with the boys it's the fact that she was directing and me sean was sitting right next to me but she was looking at me saying it and I'm like I don't even like children.
Speaker 2:I don't want to do stuff like that sean will, I'm sure he will, and they're well, it'd be great if you could, and I'm like no yeah.
Speaker 1:And this is the thing You're busy You're busy running a business and, like I said, about what have you had to sacrifice? There are certain people, mums, that would be like oh my God, you're terrible for doing that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%, and I know maybe they might listen to this, my thing any of my friends and family.
Speaker 3:I was the least maternal person. How I've ended up having all the kids I have no idea, but I'm the least maternal person in my family. I've never been that interested in having kids and I'm not really that interested in other people's kids no, I'm not either like it doesn't come naturally to some people. They're just so natural around children and it just isn't me. I can just about cope with my own kids.
Speaker 2:The baby stage, yeah maybe 10, 11, 12, because they can have a proper conversation but in the middle teenagers awful, yeah, so come back when you're 21, yeah we'll go to the party.
Speaker 1:I'm just not. All women are naturally maternal.
Speaker 3:Just like not all women are naturally maternal. Just like not all men are naturally paternal. Like I just don't have it in me to be Sean's more maternal than I am oh same with Paul.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, definitely same with Paul so he would have kids endless, he wouldn't he would keep going he can't now, he can't now. I don't want to sound like as women in business and I keep referring to this because I think it's quite important. Have you ever been put down, have you ever been underestimated for being a woman and trying to run a business by anybody? How did it make you feel, and do you agree with it? Did you, or did that fuel your fire, to be like no, do you know what? Fuck you, I can do this.
Speaker 3:You know what I get all the time when I've had, I've quite often um had staff that are older than me, like florists or shopkeepers that are older than me, and someone will come in to ask a question and they'll ask my work experience student because she's older than me and they'll, they'll look at her and I'll even then answer the question and they still look at the older person, thinking that they must be in charge because they're older, or they must be in charge. Yeah, it's just like I've always had an issue with people can't get their heads around. Maybe not now I've aged a lot, but when I first opened the shop maybe I look quite young. I like to think you still look young.
Speaker 3:People like look past me, thinking young blonde female can't be in charge, can't possibly own this business, that I get that a lot and I go. You know, ash, I go to quite a lot. Well, not so much now, but I go to some networking stuff and it's all very corporate and it's quite male dominated finance lawyers, solicitors, and I will get the oh, you're a florist, what's a florist, young florist, doing here in in a room full of trying to sell you flowers, you know yeah and then I'm laughing because 90 of them walk out with my cards and phone me up for flowers.
Speaker 3:I think that's why I was there. I was there because everyone needs a florist. I might not be a big player in the corporate world, you might not find me in canary wharf, but I've got a space and I just want to own it you do and you do yeah brilliant.
Speaker 1:What about you, danny? Because your industry is probably very male dominated very very, I would imagine a lot of the reps, a lot of the fitters, a lot of every fitter I've come, I haven't.
Speaker 2:I'm yet to come across a female bathroom fitter, to be fair um, that's a daily reminder, isn't it, that there's still something gender related in these industries and, yeah, this, this industry is very male dominated and, um, yeah, I, usually what I come across is um, a couple come in because they want to start talking about, you know, getting their bathrooms done and we'll be talking. And I know my shit, I do, and I don't care if that sounds big-headed, I don't care if that sounds like I'm full of myself. I know what I'm doing, I really really do and I, if I don't know what I'm doing, I will, I will find out. But 98% of the time I'm doing, so, the amount of times I do get men unintentionally, most of the time it will be the men that will talk to me about drainage and are, but the waste is here and and I'm like, yeah, that's fine, I, I, you don't need to tell me that, I know, I know what's going on. Um, I have to, really, I normally have to find to make it stop.
Speaker 2:I will have to find a way of picking holes in what they're telling me, because most of the time they're not fitters, they're not, they're not you know, they don't know they're diy enthusiasts and there's a reason why they're in with you to come to see me because they don't know what they're doing, and I have to sometimes I have to subtly pick those little holes apart to just prove myself and insert my knowledge into the bits that they aren't saying because they don't know exists just to make them be like, okay, she knows her shit, she does know what she's doing. Then okay, fair enough. Um, you know, I will I have. One of my biggest things is I will have men within the industry that call me aggressive and that really I can't explain to you how much rage it fills me with, because actually I'm not aggressive, I'm just assertive and I know what I want and I know how to get things done.
Speaker 2:That does not make me aggressive that just makes you scared of me because I'm a threat now and um, that's what, that's why, back when we were talking about me being actually really emotional, that's the front that I have to.
Speaker 2:I have to put that front because you're in that male dominated because I'm in that once I'm comfortable with people and somebody knows me and I know that they respect me for knowing what I know Then the emotional side of me comes out. But you know, I do get called aggressive a lot. I'm like no, I'm not. I'm not aggressive, I'm assertive. You just don't like that, you don't like something like that.
Speaker 2:yeah, it's something that makes you feel uncomfortable Because, whether you like that feeling or not, it's because it is a female, a younger female, telling you something that you didn't actually know, or having to correct you on something. Yeah, and that's actually what grinds on on some men. So that is something that definitely is a thing, and I am having to constantly fight that battle. And I know other franchisees as well. There are a few female franchisees, actually, which we're really proud of as a group, um, but some of the longest standing franchisees are female owned and you know, someone was saying the other day that she constantly has to assert herself. You know, because of the space you're in, because you have to fill your space, yeah, with I know what I'm doing, um, and that is difficult. I mean, when we're turning up to these awards, these award ceremonies, you know like 900 people strong and I can tell you now, 85% of them are men, and that can feel really yeah, but how much more amazing is it that you took home one of those awards in those statistics?
Speaker 2:yeah, absolutely, and I'm very proud of it, really really proud of it, especially as the last one we won was like a fully judged. You know, a judge comes around and actually you spoke to her, didn't you?
Speaker 1:funnily enough.
Speaker 2:Um, and yeah, it's. It can be difficult sometimes and I have to remind myself sometimes that not every man is thinking that as well. Yeah, I have to remind myself that not every bloke is walking in going. Of course she's a girl, she don't know what she's doing. I have to remind myself of that, actually, that there are quite a lot of men out there that won't even think about oh well, you're a girl.
Speaker 2:You don't know what you're talking about. There's loads of men that don't think like that, but it's the ones that do that stick out that you think well yeah hold on, you've got to be a bit more bullshit here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but I also started working within the trade. So you know I was in, I was working for like Dulux decorator center, like trade um trade counter as soon as I left school and then I went into like plumbing trade centers and things like that. So I'm quite used to being in male dominated places which I think is really helping to me as I've grown. Now I think yeah, it's.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's important, don't matter what. You're always gonna have people look down on you, aren't you? You're always gonna, no matter whether you're a male or a female you're always gonna have people. I mean, look at some of these 16 year olds making more money than all three of us put together like it's crazy.