The Untold Podcast
UNTOLD Podcast is where business, family, and life collide—raw, unfiltered, and brutally honest. No fluff, no fake success stories—just real conversations about the highs, the struggles, and everything in between.
The Untold Podcast
Episode 16 | Breaking the Silence, How important is Mental Health
This might be the most important episode we've ever recorded.
Ash and Chris dive headfirst into the brutal reality of men’s mental health—from financial pressure and toxic masculinity to the silent suffering most men carry every day. This raw, emotional and honest episode pulls no punches. We talk about debt, divorce, addiction, suicide, social media, and why so many men feel like they’re barely holding it together.
But more importantly, we offer real-life perspective, personal stories, and some hope.
If you’re struggling, or you’ve got someone in your life who is, this episode might help you understand things in a way you never have before.
🔗 Need help?
We mention:
- Andy's Man Club
- MATES: Men and Their Emotions
- Citizens Advice
This one’s for the men who say “I’m fine” but aren’t.
You are not alone. You matter.
The internet has ruined everybody. My brain told me my world was going to collapse. I owed a quarter of a million quid and I had less than a thousand pound in the bank. The human race is fucked.
Speaker 2:Reach out, be nice to people, speak to them. Them stop hiding. Um, it's just horrible to think about, isn't it?
Speaker 1:today's episode is sponsored by closer, the app that helps you discover exclusive local deals right here in sussex. Whether you're after a pint, a haircut or a last minute gift, closer shows you where to go and what you can save, all from the comfort of your phone. It's free to download, easy to use and packed with offers from the best spots around. Download the closer app today from the app store that's closr.
Speaker 2:Save money, support local with closer hi everybody, welcome to today's episode of the untold podcast. No des today, so it's just the main people, obviously me and ash morning. Ash morning, chris, how you doing buddy, good mate, I'm good, right, the Untold Podcast no Des today, so it's just the main people, obviously Me and Ash.
Speaker 2:Morning Ash, morning Chris. How you doing, buddy? I'm good mate, I'm good Right, anyone that's listening. If you're expecting the usual podcast lots of laughs, a bit of piss taking and a bit of banter this is going to be a little bit different to usual, a little bit more deeper.
Speaker 2:We thought it was really important to kind of dive really deep into men's mental health. So I'm going to give you some statistics first, just so you can get an idea of how bad it is in the UK. And please keep listening, because just because you don't struggle with mental health doesn't mean that your husband, your boyfriend, your brother, anyone, your mate, your sister. So to start off with the suicide rates among men, you'll notice that I'm actually, if you're watching, I'm going to be looking down at this because this is really important. Rates among men You'll notice that I'm actually, if you're watching, I'm going to be looking down at this because this is really important that I get this right. The highest suicide rates among men. Men account for approximately 75% of all suicides in the UK. That is massive, it is.
Speaker 1:It's too big.
Speaker 2:Is it.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, any suicide is too big.
Speaker 2:The leading cause of death of men under the age of 50. I mean, that's the leading cause of death of all men male under 50.
Speaker 1:Is it really?
Speaker 2:Yeah, See I didn't know that it's not cancer, it's not getting run over or anything. It's suicide. Yeah, the age group that most affected is between the age of 45 and 49. Is it really so? Basically me. Yeah, the age group that most affected is between the age of 45 and 49. Is it really so? Basically me, yeah, you're not quite. 45.
Speaker 1:You're not that young, are you?
Speaker 2:Well, I'm 43, but I class myself as middle-aged. Do you know what I mean? The Northwest has a much, much higher suicide rate than the South. I think that is obvious, to be fair. I think the cost of living is bad across the country, but I think the earnings are much better down here than they are up north, so I can kind of understand that one the increase in suicide rates in 2023. These stats are all from 2023 because there aren't any more current ones. The suicide rate in England and Wales reached its highest level since 1999. Now you've got to put into concept there that obviously was COVID, a lot of of that, wasn't it? You know the financial burden of COVID, but they think that obviously, because people aren't reporting attempted suicides and stuff like that, the statistics could be a lot higher than that, which again is just. It's just horrible to think about.
Speaker 1:It's mad as well, because I that's 2023. Yeah, the society has declined massively, I would say, since 2023. The last 12 months, things just, see, keep seem to get harder and harder and harder. It's the squeeze, isn't?
Speaker 2:it, yeah, just a constant, constant squeeze. And if you are, unless you have got a really strong mentality, it it's so odd, so odd. Then we have got. More than 90% of everybody that commits suicide has got some sort of mental health issue or a drug or alcohol addiction. So there's people out there that know people have got mental health issues and an alcohol or drug addiction. You need to look after these people. A drug addiction and an alcohol addiction doesn't necessarily mean it's that person's fault. They just got lost along the way yeah, and it's easy, isn't it?
Speaker 1:if you're fit, healthy, your life's going fantastic. You don't need to turn to drugs and alcohol. Yeah, it's. Do you know what I mean? I spent a lot of time listening to dapper laughs, dan o'reilly's podcast about mental sobriety and what, even just watching his journey, and he's got lived experience of it. You use drugs and alcohol. I mean, I've done it before. I went through a stage of drinking at least a bottle of wine a night when I got home, just to mask real life. So when life's shit, you want to mask real life. When life's good, then it's obviously you have a drink to enjoy it. But when you're using drugs and alcohol to escape the reality of life, that's when I think it becomes really dangerous.
Speaker 2:And the sad realisation of that is if you go to drugs and alcohol, it does mask it, it doesn't get rid of it.
Speaker 1:You're just pushing it down the rank and when you're not drinking or taking those drugs.
Speaker 2:It becomes even worse because you're not only on the comedown, you're also having to deal with all that mental health issue anyway. So it's not the way to go at all, really, really isn't? The study suggests, actually, that individuals who die by suicide had actually contacted their mental health advisors or reached out for help at some point and been ignored.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's another big problem, because you can't do. You know what I mean you. You ring your GP up and say, oh, I'm suicidal. Okay, you can have an appointment in six weeks time to see me and then to get in front of someone, unless you've got money to pay privately. And that's where the likes of Dan's man Club and stuff come in, because they are helping, they are trying to raise money to make it more accessible for people to be able to actually get the help they need, because it is up here, the brain is the most powerful muscle in a body isn't it?
Speaker 2:Now, this is not a suicide one, but I think this is really important to mention this, because everyone, when they think about suicide, they tend to think, tend to think about men, right? This actually really upset me when I read this yesterday 33 of every teenage boy between the age of 14 and 18 has at some point tried to either self-harm themselves or commit suicide. That is fucking disgusting.
Speaker 1:Because they're not even old enough to understand really to do that, and social media has got a lot of things to blame for that, I think.
Speaker 2:It's exactly the conversation me and my wife had yesterday. The exact same conversation. If you would have gone back 20 years, I guarantee you that number would be five percent. The kids. Kids weren't stuck indoors, they were going out with their friends, they were playing in the mud and going up the park and kicking the football about. That thought process wasn't there. But because it's always over social media everything, yeah, it's horrible and it must be. I'd hate to be a teenager now and I worry so much about my little boy, especially after reading that last night. Yeah, I've got two.
Speaker 1:I've got my 16-year-old. He's quite streetwise, he knows, now he's learned. But I've got two girls. My 11-year-old is already very, very sensitive, very sensitive, and, whereas you can't hide your kids away from social media, because it's there, whether we like it or not, if they're, not on it they're taking the piss out of at school.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, it's just a newsworthy situation, but then if they're on it, they're posting a video.
Speaker 1:They're a little bit overweight, their hair's a bit frizzy, their hair's a bit greasy. They start getting spots and there are horrible. Kids are fucking horrible and there are horrible kids are fucking horrible.
Speaker 2:Sorry, but kids are horrible. I said it the other day, didn't I Last week's? Well, the one that's come out today, the internet, has ruined everybody. It's been great, but it has been ruined by everybody.
Speaker 1:Back in our day, back in my day, growing up, msn Messenger was a thing and that just come out, msn Messenger. But you didn't spend the time on it that you spend on now, because you had to sit on the computer. You had to make sure your mum and dad weren't picking up the phone and making a phone call. And I remember once there was a couple of girls and, as you do, as a kid I was probably 14. I was in the living room dancing in my pants and they were outside my house watching me.
Speaker 2:Bit weird now looking back at it. Maybe they did fancy me.
Speaker 1:But then I went into school and I was getting a barrage of abuse from five or six girls on MSN messenger saying we can see you, we're watching you through your window.
Speaker 2:At least they didn't have the proof.
Speaker 1:Well, exactly that's the difference between nowadays.
Speaker 2:Nowadays it is scary. It is scary. Yeah, I mean going into that teenage side of things. You know, you've only got to look at, you see, like you know all the people sending pictures of each other and stuff like to each other and like they're dating, and that you send a picture of yourself. Do never send a picture of yourself, because I know somebody at school near me it was all over the, the mum's page on on the where I live somebody had sent an explicit picture of themselves to somebody else in class and they'd shared it with the whole school. You know, it's just as it's so easy now, bang, and you can kind of understand. Now we're talking about it, you can kind of understand. Well, that's the statistic.
Speaker 1:Statistic is a thing, can't you, because it is so easy to get trapped in to that social media side of things at that age yeah, they live their life through it, live their life through it and their highlight reel is all they're ever going to see, because that's allowed to post stuff on TikTok, but she's not allowed to include her face. Yeah, and the other day she come to me and she was like oh yeah, look, daddy, my video got X amount of views and I said it doesn't matter. What matters is you're doing it because you enjoy doing it. That's what matters. It doesn't matter You're going to have people hate you. You're going to have people love you. You're going to have people disagree with you, but that's like a stepping stone now for life. Yeah, obviously, with what you do, there's people that probably disagree with what you do. There's people that support you, but you do what you do and you can't let other people in and ruin your mental stability because they've got a different opinion.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's very important. That's a very valid point, mate. To be fair, you're uh. The difference is, though you're, you're uh anyone that listens you, then we know you're a good parent. You talk to your kids, you explain things, and you do do things with your parents, your kids. But there's a lot of kids out there. Don't get that in there. I mean, they just just get free flow, do whatever you want. At 13 years old, you're not allowed on tiktok, but you can have an account anyway. Do what you want and read what you want. Yeah, um right, let's get back to the men's, men's side of things. Um, what do you think the reasons are nowadays, like, as in for the suicide rates, that they are like we've got stuff like economic pressure I think, yeah, I think, economic pressure, I think job pressure.
Speaker 1:Um, obviously I'd like to see how many of those stats are within the construction industry. Yeah, I think one of the big things is horrible, horrible women using children against their ex-partners after a separation. Because that system's fucked Like. That system is horrible. The system always will favour the mum, no matter who she is, no matter what she's done. I know people.
Speaker 1:I went to an event that Sam Thompson did called Are you Alright, mate, and there was a lad there. We sort of sectioned up into groups and there was a lad there told his story about he sold his house, everything to fight for his daughter Because the new stepdad was not being particularly nice to her. Won't go into details, but he had to fight for that. He had to go through the courts and get himself into hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of debt just to fight for his daughter and he had the proof that these things were happening. Yeah, the 13 year old sat there with a solicitor and said look this, this is happening and this is happening. I don't want to live there anymore. But he couldn't do. You know what I mean? He had to physically and that, I think, is a massive, massive part of those rates. Definitely, I think. Job, job satisfaction. Um, you go to work 7, 30, 5 o'clock every day. Your boss is a bit of an ar. You're literally living to work, working, you're working to live not living to work.
Speaker 1:You're working to live every single day, no matter how much you do, no matter how hard you work. You just can't seem to get to the end of it, and I think that's a big point. So I think you've got women using children to manipulate things. I think that's massive and I think that needs a huge shakeup. Then you've got the financial pressures and the fact that you're working. Now you're earning the same, but everything's costing 20%, 30% more. People can't afford holidays anymore, Whereas you look forward to every year a nice family holiday. People can't do that because it's so bloody expensive. But what do you think? What are your views?
Speaker 2:yeah, I have to agree with you there, mate. I mean, you know I'm a one household income and it is very stressful. You know, you, you have bills and you have bills, and you have bills and you have bills and you have a certain amount of money put aside for it all the time. And I am quite an old school person. You know, I don't want my wife to work particularly hard. I don't expect her to. I'm the alpha male in my house. You know, I want to provide for my family.
Speaker 2:But at the same time, when you act like that, it causes you so much more stress because you put this thing on your shoulder, that you have to be this strong man. You have to be the one that doesn cry. You have to be the one that doesn't talk to your missus because you don't want to share your problems with her, because she's got problems of her own. She's looking after the kid, she's upset when he's upset and you know it plays a lot on your mind. And then the brakes go on your car and you get a bill for £1,000 for some new discs and you think she's got to use the car. Where am I going to get that money from? It's just a constant financial burden, isn't it? Yeah?
Speaker 1:Everything's just so. I would imagine that a lot of those statistics that you read out earlier do boil down to financial reasons.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the thing is as well, it's easy. Again, the same with drugs and alcohol. It's easy to get into that gambling. I haven't got the money, what can I do? It's easy to get into that gambling.
Speaker 2:I haven't got the money. What can I do? I've got a hundred quid in my bank. We spoke about that the other day, didn't we Actually like how easy it is to just spend your money?
Speaker 1:online gambling. Oh, let's go online online.
Speaker 2:And then you get all these things.
Speaker 1:And then you'll go on one website and then your Instagram feed your tick slots, submit 20 pound and we'll guarantee you a spin and a win. And they're like oh yeah, let's do that. I saw something the other day I can't remember who it was Was interviewing someone. He said why have you just gone and bought 40 quid for scratch cards? And the guy was like well, because it's my last 40 quid, I need to try and turn it into something. But that's mad Cause. That's the mentality, the people. I need something to change. I need something to change and that's the easy option Quick fix. That could be the quick fix, but 99.998% of the time it ain't going to happen because the system's rigged to not work in your favor.
Speaker 2:I bought 10 of those scratch cards 10 quids worth the other day on my birthday and won two pound.
Speaker 1:That's a good return isn't it Basically the estate? Quid Good return isn eight quid but you still get.
Speaker 2:Oh, I've won two pounds that's what they do it for, and then you get that little bit of endorphins in your body and you think, oh, dopamine or whatever it's called, and then you're going back for more. I think a lot of things really. I mean, I've got a very good mate of mine. I mentioned him in the podcast the other day, a couple of weeks ago in fact. I his problems, while he never talks, and I think it's like a stigma thing, isn't it? Like the man has got to be strong, the man can't talk. It's the caveman theory, isn't it? I know he's been struggling. I know he's been struggling. I know there's no way the shit that he's gone through in the last two years that he hasn't wanted to reach out at some point, but he just doesn't, and I think that is what men do Unless he just doesn't. And I think that is what men do, unless you've been to the breaking point.
Speaker 2:My other friend was at breaking point. He reached out to me, thankfully, and I put him in contact with a therapist that I was using previously and he loved it, absolutely loved going to see her, and it sorted him right out. He's sweet as a nut now Still has the odd day where he messaged me or whatever, but he's perfect, but I think it is that stigma of I can't reach out because I don't want my wife to see me weak, I don't want my children to see me crumble. He might go up in his bedroom and shut the door at night and cry his eyes out for 10 minutes, I don't know, but he would never let us know that and I think that's a really sad thing, because it's like that in silence, isn't it? And that's kind of why people do what they do. Yeah, because they go away on their own and they, their thought process changes, and I don't know it's is. It actually really does upset me when I think about it it's.
Speaker 1:It's crazy because it's always the one. You see these stories, you see these posts, you speak to people. It's always the one you never expect it from because they're putting on that facade, they're trying to be brave, they want to be, they want to be again. It boils down to the people not being themselves and not like this stigmatism of a man, alpha man, cave man, bang on your chest, get shit done. Yes, you still need that, because that's attractive, that will keep you going.
Speaker 2:I mean, otherwise, we live in a completely woke world, don't we? Where there is no masculinity, there is no femininity or anything.
Speaker 1:But you've got to. I mean, if you've got loved ones, you've got to share how you're feeling with them, and I think it's really like your friend went to therapy, really enjoyed it. I think if you're struggling mentally, there is lots of different ways to try and get that out of you, to try and work with it and to build that mental resilience. Look, you've got debt collectors letters dropping through the door. You've got. Do you know what I mean? You've got people people at work, for example being horrible to you. You've got to go and speak to the boss. You don't want to speak to boss, you don't want to be a grass and stuff. It's again communication, isn't it?
Speaker 2:and I think you've got to be able to communicate with the people closest to you your parents or I think you need to go through something in your life that prepares you to be mentally secure. Yeah, I think that's important, like some people can. Some people can process things, some people can't. The people that can process are the ones that are fine, the they're the ones that get on with their life. They don't need the help. They can box things up and they can filter it out and do it their own way, but obviously the other people that don't go through that struggle. Now I think it's important for everybody listening that we kind of show our own little bit of vulnerability here. There we go.
Speaker 2:Which kind of leads that into my section. So I'm actually going to go first on this, yeah, yeah. So I taught myself when I was very, very young to be very stable and it took me to the point of nearly thinking maybe this isn't for me, maybe this is what you're supposed to do in life. When shit hits the fan, it's the easy way out. But because I was watching the person in my life that was my Superman do that, it made me decide no, I'm not going to do that actually. No, I need to be strong, because that is a bad way of doing it. He was going to leave me behind because it was the easiest option for him. Now I'm not going to say it is, but it's, obviously it is. You know, I'm not I'm not going to call him out on the, on the uh, on the podcast, because that would be really unfair. But if he, if he does listen, he's going to notice him anyway. But you know he was the most influential person in my life, um, and we went through something when I was like 13, 14, uh, that I walked into, that I saw and it wasn't particularly nice, and then he obviously took massive responsibility for it and things happened. You know like I became. I became a a weekend kid. You know. You went with one parent at one weekend and the other one another one. But, um, for six months I watched that man regret every single decision that he made in the few months that he was doing what he was doing, and when he was regretting those decisions, he was drinking very heavily. He was trying to take his own life. I was trying to stop him. All the time I was phoning the police, I was chasing after him and at 13, 14 years of age, that was not a nice thing to go through, you know, um, and probably six months ago I would have sat here and I would have actually probably been quite upset about that. But because we've spoken about stuff on the podcast before, I think my emotions are now opening up properly in my head and I'm able to filter them out correctly where, as I taught myself at that age, that is not what you do, because you are responsible for other people. Now I'm responsible for my children and, to a certain extent, for my wife, you know, um. So that is not something that I would ever allow my thought process to to take hold of, um, so you know it's.
Speaker 2:Everybody deals with mental health issues. At some point I went through um health anxiety when I had my stroke six, seven months. I was in pieces. I didn't really know what to do because I thought I was going to die. I thought I had a brain tumor to start with, and then, all of a sudden, I was all right and I was released from hospital. And now you've got to come back once a year for a test. Fuck me, I've just had two strokes in the same day and you're telling me I can go home and I'm fine, when I'm 39 years of age and you're telling me that hang on a minute, I'm not fine, am I? What's going on?
Speaker 2:So I dealt with social, with the. You know, my health anxiety is now on my son, my three-year-old son. If he's ill, I'm like, oh my god, is he all right? What's wrong with him? Yeah, but I've trained myself and I think that's what I said about a minute ago. If you go through something at an early age, I do think that actually hardens you up and gets you ready. Yeah, you know. So that's kind of my story. So I want to do, I want to hear maybe what you've got to say now if you've ever dealt with anything like that I spoke about it before, um, and it still.
Speaker 1:It still weighs on me a lot. And this is where I've realized now I've gone through my life looking at people with mental health, never really felt it, so thinking that it's not real. Um, and then I went through a tough couple of years, me and my wife who we're absolutely fine now, by the way. We didn't see eye to eye and I sort of moved out for a couple of weeks around Christmas time. That was soul-destroying. Moved out of the family home, ended up back with my parents for a few weeks, trying my hardest, and we both saw a therapist and spoke about our differences. And we both saw a therapist and spoke about our differences and touch wood. In four years we have never been to bed upset with each other. I don't think there's been an argument in four years Now. For me that's amazing because now we've learned to talk about it as it comes and that can be a big thing.
Speaker 1:But when I realized that something in my life had to, had to change was like I said before my mom took some money out of her pension pot and took us away skiing for christmas. My brother, my brother's missus, my mom and dad, my wife, the kids, um, and it was beautiful. It's like my most favorite place in the world, a little village called latania, in the free valleys in france. We used to go there as a kid, um, and it was so amazing to take my kids there and show my kids and go sledging with them and stuff and go skiing in the day and see my kids on a pair of skis, because I've been privileged enough to do it since I was four years old, like.
Speaker 1:But what I was doing is I was. I remember. I remember like vividly remember I was not there. I was there, but mentally I just was not there and the crazy thoughts that go through your head that you sort of switch on and switch off. But for the whole seven days I don't feel I was present at any point other than in the evening when I'd had a few drinks. That's really sad, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Cause you've wanted that, I've wanted that and that was probably the last time it was going to happen. Do you know what I mean? And I remember going out on my own and my brother had gone off on his own. The kids didn't want to ski anymore for the day. And I remember going and I went to my favorite place in the world. The top of the mountain is called salure anybody that's been to three valleys will know and it's a big long run all the way down. You've done it. And it's a big long run back down and I just sitting on the chairlift, just crying my eyes out on my own in the most beautiful place in the world the sun was shining crying my fucking eyes out.
Speaker 1:And for three days after that I was listening to podcasts. I was doing everything I possibly could to get out of my head and the real reason was I had a business. I owed a quarter of a million quid and I had less than a thousand pounds in a bank. That was the real reason for everything For me not being there, for me ruining that moment was financial and in my head all the time my whole world's going to come crumbling down. I owe all this money. There's nothing in the bank Struggling to buy the next dinner on the holiday, and the kids want this, and the kids want that, and we want to do this and that. And I'm, as a man, right. How am I going to get this right? Let's pay a bit off of that credit card, move a bit to that, and then I've got a couple of hundred quid. Beautiful let's, and that was. Is it sad? It is sad that it was that, but my brain would told me that my world was going to collapse. This is three years ago now and it didn't did it. It didn't, it didn't, it never does. And I kick myself to this day because that might've been the last time we could do it as a family. Yeah, and I kick myself to this day because of that. And that was all in my head and I'd go to bed at night and I'd have a few glass of wine with dinner, as you do, a few beers and that, and I'd sit there and I'd be all fine.
Speaker 1:And then, three o'clock in the morning, after the alcohol's worn off and the anxiety kicks in, I'm awake, I'm pacing the apartment, I'm going outside, I'm having a fag, I'm pacing the apartment, I'm on the sofa, the wife what's up? Why are you not coming to bed. I can't sleep. I can't sleep because my world's gonna end crying on the fucking sofa three o'clock in the morning in a lovely chalet, in my most happiest place in the fucking world. And that's the moment I realized this isn't right. What? What can I do to fix this?
Speaker 1:And I came back and I did the mindfulness course and the mindfulness thing was mental for me because it allowed. I didn't do it, I didn't go in 110%, I didn't do the meditation that I was supposed to do, but it allowed me to learn that these thoughts come into your brain, let them pass. I remember lying there one day and she was going right, lie on there, breathe. You do the breathing and you can. It's amazing. If you do it, you can breathe into your toes, you can feel your toes and and all this.
Speaker 1:I remember I lying there one day and said right, like, imagine you lie there and your thoughts are like clouds in the sky. And I was there with my eyes closed and I can see the blue sky and the clouds. And she's like your thoughts are like clouds, they come into vision and then let them go again and then come and acknowledge them. Acknowledge they're there and then let them go again, because that's the present time, that's what you're doing. So that was it for me. That's when I realized that something had to change and touch wood, like I said before I ended up, I think, did that business for another year, struggled on, showed up every day, got the debt down, paid everybody I could begged, borrowed and stole, got it done. And that's what taught me, I think, the mental resilience that I have today when it comes to business and you can move that in other aspects of your life it's building. That resilience isn't it.
Speaker 1:It's like you said you build that, you learn. I did a podcast yesterday with a couple of lovely girls who've been in business and we just spoke. We spoke about showing up. Showing up and admitting that there's a problem Admitting in everything in your life. If you've been a dick to your missus, it's no good. Well, I wasn't a dick, I wasn't a dick, it wasn't me. Admit that and then you can move forward from it. If you keep trying to push these problems down the road and not acknowledge them, it's like if you've got a drinking problem, they say the first thing is admitting you've got a problem, yeah, and then you can move on with it. And that was me. I admitted well, I've got a fucking serious problem here. I've got some really dark thoughts. I'm in the best place in the world and I'm crying on a fucking chairlift. What is wrong with you? And then something clicked and I was on a mission then to get myself out of that and I'm rambling now.
Speaker 2:Don't worry, no, it's good, it's good to hear, mate, because it gives me an insight to things as well. You know not obviously, just people just listening, but I just want to pick out on something that you just said about there, about debt. So we've both said that money is kind of the the main reason we think. Right, I've learned over my life this is for anybody that is actually listening right now I've learned in my lifetime that debt is not a problem. It's a problem that you cause, but it's a problem that you can get out of. So it's not a problem, right, if you're in debt and you've got debt collectors after you bring the debt collection. They don't want your fucking car, they don't want your fucking TV, they don't want your house. They want you to pay your debts. Ring them. If you owe the child support agency a fuckload of money, ring them. Don't ignore them. They want to work with you.
Speaker 2:As men, we decide to block everything out because it's easier. I'll shut the fucking door. No one can come in. I'll put an extra lock on the front door. I'll I'll turn my phone off. I won't answer that phone call.
Speaker 2:Answer the phone calls, sort your debts out, clear your fucking head of all the shit that goes on, because that will make you feel one million times better, and I can tell you it does, because I've done it myself. Right, I've run away from banks when I was, when I was a. I've been a tow rag mate. Right, I've not always been the nice person that I'm here. I mean I've always been nice, but I've been a tow rag. I got an overdraft just to draw it all out and go out and get absolutely fucked for about three weeks, go on holiday and just waste it. Then I just threw all the bank letters in the bin, just open another bank account with someone else until they came chasing for me for thousands of pounds. And then I finally my mum said to me just ring the bank, speak to them, stop hiding. Stopped hiding, paid the debt off within about four months and I was.
Speaker 1:I didn't have that pressure on my head anymore that's it and it's and I've learned this as well from like. You go to sleep and I'll wake up all my problems and my brain's overactive about between the hours of four and six in the morning. So you're trying to sleep and everything comes into your head. Now those thoughts wouldn't come in my head if I was living life the best way that I could, if I was being the best person I possibly could, if I was phoning that person back, if I wasn't burying my head in the sand and admitting okay, you fucked up there, mate, what can you do to make it better? And I say to the team at work yes, you're going to have problems in your life, but don't focus on the problem, focus on the solution. Yeah, because that and that early.
Speaker 2:Yeah, don't leave it to the last minute.
Speaker 1:Cause, don't leave it to the last minute, because then that's when you're screwed again. It's admit, okay, I fucking made a mistake. Yeah, how can I get? What can I do to make this better for myself? And there are thousands of things, like, if you're in debt, there's charities that you can go to, there's free advice you can go to, citizens advice you can go to, and that's one thing in the uk I haven't used it for years, but whenever, whenever I need anything, citizens Advice is brilliant and you can go there and you can book an appointment and you can speak to someone and just again, by speaking about that problem and not internalising it, makes you feel better instantly.
Speaker 2:Now, I'm not sitting here preaching it's all our problems, it's all our fault, because there are things in life that aren't your fault and you do get dealt with. You know, when your ex-wife's a bitch or whatever, you know, or you're being used as a scapegoat, or you're being used as like I don't know whatever. But you know what I'm trying to say. It's not everybody, it's not all of our fault, but a lot um, but this is, this is really going on, this one as well. So, um, which is good, because I kind of wanted it to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's not something that I wanted to just just skirt over now. There's loads of things out there. There's loads of communities and stuff you can join to help out, especially for men. You know we're talking about men's mental health here, so you know one that is fantastic and it's got so much support, yeah, so, mates.
Speaker 1:So mates, men and their emotions. It was something that, again, daniel set up. Dapper laughs for people that I call him Daniel, now Daniel O'Reilly, daniel O'Reilly, because I feel that the dapper laughs. I think he's evolving into Daniel O'Reilly. Yeah, yeah, the sober dad who's present and in the moment. Yeah, now, if you're not part of the mates community, it's a Facebook group with like 50,000 lads on it and it's very heavily monitored. All the comments, all the posts, everything you can post anonymously, and some of the advice like I look at it a lot.
Speaker 1:I look at it a lot Because sometimes you can help someone out by just giving that one comment. Now, it's a wicked community of people that have done a very similar thing. You could think that you're the only one going through it. I guarantee you there's someone on that group 50,000 lads in the UK. I guarantee you there's someone in that group that has been through what you've gone through or going through what you're going through.
Speaker 1:Some of the posts is like look, my missus has kicked me out. I've got nothing. She's taking the kids away from me. What can I do? I'll use this solicitor that I use. Or mate, whereabouts are you? Where do you live? I've got a spare room. You can have it for a week. These are people that don't know each other, connecting because they connect because they've lived experiences. And I think what he's done with the group is phenomenal and he'll post in there and he scrolls through it and he's actually turned it into a registered charity and he's got massive, massive plans for it to help lads get the help they need, because you can't get it on the NHS, you can't get it through your GP. All they're going to do is give you happy pills Now. In my opinion that's good for the interim, but after seeing people that have taken tablets and prescribed tablets, they're on them for five or six years.
Speaker 2:It kind of goes back to the statistic, doesn't it? Exactly Most men that commit suicide have actually already reached out for help from GPs and stuff and obviously just not get the help.
Speaker 1:I mean, if you're, if you're on Facebook, m A, t, e, s, men and their emotions go and join the group and be a part of it, or just sit on the sidelines and read, because I guarantee you it will blow your mind.
Speaker 2:The generosity of people in there, yeah, Then the other one, of course, is Andy's man Club. Yeah, that's getting big now, I didn't really know much about the backstory about Andy's man Club. To be fair, I didn't realise it was set up for Andy, who killed himself, which is quite strong, isn't it? I like it when people do things for people that have actually passed away but, andy, recently I've run over 240 different support groups across the country.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a new one in Brighton. Yeah, so 240. Like we don't live that far away from everybody in this country, do we? So 240 groups. There's definitely one near you. Guys, if you do need any help, then look it up online. You'll find it really easily. It's very straightforward process to get involved as well. But then, most importantly, I think the biggest help out there is you, and that's not you, ash, I'm pointing at the camera, but most people don't watch this.
Speaker 2:It is you guys. Reach out, be nice to people. If somebody seems like they're struggling, ask them if they're struggling, because the best thing to do is ask somebody if they're struggling. Don't go you all right, mate, because he'll go. Yeah, I'm all right, and that's it. Ask him are you struggling? You seem to be struggling or are you all right? You seem a little bit down or something, because if you ask a question with a question, yeah, you're more likely to get an answer that you want rather than are you okay, mate? That's just a question, yeah yeah, yeah, what's up?
Speaker 2:no, nothing, mate, I'm sweet, I'm sweet, dig in dive balls deep and ask don't go balls deep on your mate.
Speaker 1:But sorry, I had to throw a bit of batter in just to break it up a bit, or if you're that way and kind, then he might enjoy it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he might enjoy it but no, I think, the most important people out there ourselves. You know, if you feel like your mates are struggling, if you feel like your husband or your boyfriend or your brother, your cousin, whatever any man in your life or any woman, let's face it, you know we should be looking after each other. Just reach out we should.
Speaker 1:The human race? Yeah, okay, the human race is fucked. Yeah, let's be honest. Like I don't want to get into politics, I don't want to get into war, but let's be honest, human connection is at the lowest that it has ever been. Yeah, but surround yourself with people. Surround yourself with people that can better your life. Surround yourself with people you feel comfortable around. Surround yourself with people you can be yourself around. If you're feeling shit, I think you should be able to call your mate. Maybe not all of them, but you should have two or three mates that you can ring and say lads, I'm fucking feeling shit.
Speaker 1:When me and my missus went through the thing, I had one friend who was fucking sound and I'd ring him and he'd tell me you're being a drama queen. No, I agree with you on that. He wouldn't tell me what I wanted to hear. He told me the realness from him sitting on the outside. Yeah, he offered me space. I've got two friends in Ireland. Mate, come over. I said I can't come over, I'm skinned or we'll fly over. This was during COVID and these two lads flew from Ireland and we had a doner kebab in a premier inn and we had to tell the people. We were all gay lovers because otherwise they wouldn't let us in the room together. Do you know what I mean? And that, that building that circle of but be that person as well. Yeah, I think that's the thing, if we all aim to be that person who supports their friends, their colleagues, their everything, and just just try and be a better person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm going to use so obviously I do lives on TikTok. My favorite saying on TikTok is when I do a load of sales, I always say at the end of the sales Ipin any products up. So there's nothing on the screen and I say, listen, hit the follow button. It's not for my benefit, it's for other people. I always say this we live in a proper shit world at the moment where nobody gives a fuck about anybody. We should all be protecting and looking after each other. So don't listen to me babbling on.
Speaker 2:You put a comment in section what you think of the products and you tell the other people that are watching the live, because they're going to listen to you rather than listen to me. We do. We live in a proper shit world where nobody gives a shit about anybody. It is a fact. You know. Years and years ago they used to have parties in the street all the time. Yeah, used to go around your next door neighbours, else they used to leave their back door open. Alright, we have got a massive problem with crime now, so you can't do that, but people used to walk in and out of back doors and go alright, sandra, put the kettle on or whatever you know like it was a big community, get yourself involved in the fucking community. Get yourself a load of friends that all think the same and that's what we're saying.
Speaker 2:Like Andy's man Club, it's so important to be involved in other things, because that is what it's a famous thing and it don't suffer in silence. Yeah, don't suffer in silence.
Speaker 1:And even if you're not having a pro, even if you're not on in having dark thoughts, even if you're not being like in that space, go and help someone else who might be go to just to try it out. Go to find Google and his man cub. Look for your local place and go along to a meeting and see what it's all about and get behind it. The more people that get behind this stuff, the more that 75% number will drop, guaranteed, the more we talk about it, the less it'll become let's be honest the government do not give a fuck about us.
Speaker 1:we have to give a fuck about each other, exactly.
Speaker 2:Simple as that. I think that's a good way to wrap it up. Mate to be fair.
Speaker 1:I think we should Fuck the government Right.
Speaker 2:This has been a long podcast, but it was really, really important for me especially. That's why I've kind of hosted this one. I know Ash is writing to his men at work as well. Look out for each other. Actually, I'm going to set you a challenge. Anyone listening right now. Next time you walk down the road, say hello to somebody.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Because that hello that person could be feeling like shit, genuinely feeling like shit. Say hello to someone, try and engage in a conversation with someone for no reason whatsoever, because you never know that one conversation, male or female, could save somebody's life, or I'm going to piggyback off the back of different hats.
Speaker 1:Sam, he did a post yesterday. I shared it on my story. Do something today. Reach out to someone. Send a whatsapp, send a text to someone you've not spoke to in a while, not because you want something, just to check in on them yeah, see how they're doing.
Speaker 2:Do you know what I was going to do today? But I didn't do it because des is in there, so he's kind of ruined the idea that I had. I was going to bring a bunch of flowers for both of you today, and that is because the first time a man ever gets flowers is at his funeral.
Speaker 1:Wow that's deep, isn't it? That is deep. Yeah, to be fair, I don't think I ever had any flowers. No, never. That's for if you want to go even further.
Speaker 2:Buy a bunch of flowers and get into a random geezer in the street yeah, not the biggest.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you've got this bruv, or you've got this mate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's it. Go on and ash, you can close this out, mate if you enjoyed the episode.
Speaker 1:Host of our quiz. I really did actually. Um, that was wicked. And you're struggling with mental health. I mean, reach out to us. Reach out to us. If you've got a story to tell, come and sit in this chair and tell your story, because if you can help one person by telling your story, then it'll be worth it. I promise you that you will feel good.
Speaker 2:That's exactly why I wanted to do this podcast, because if we can help one person exactly, I feel like I've even been out myself yeah, well, we're helping each other out all the time.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, yeah, well, we're helping each other out all the time, aren't we? So yeah, that's been the Untold Podcast hosted by the one and only Chris Stewart. Give us a comment, give us a like, give us a share. We're up to seven viewers now. We're trying to get to eight. No, I'm only kidding. But yeah, mental health is a serious thing, so look after your neighbour.
Speaker 2:And you're amazing.
Speaker 1:Yeah.